Exploring Our Biblical Heritage

Is The TORAH Sin?

What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
(Roman 7:7 NKJV)

▶ Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Jody on June 18, 2009 at 5:23pm: Shalom, Obviously this is a rhetorical question. No response needed. The Torah is the Perfect Law of Liberty.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by TISHUVAH on June 18, 2009 at 5:36pm: Shalom, Jody
Obviously rhetorical, yet it does receive responses of all sorts and hopefuly allows all to glean truths from HIS WORD.

Then again this was posted for discussion and not as doctrine.

GOD Forbid.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Jody on June 18, 2009 at 6:29pm: Shalom Tishuvah, I obviously don't understand the question. Quoting the Word is always appreciated, but without a question or suggestion, I don't see much if any discussion.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Jody on June 18, 2009 at 6:43pm: Shalom, I personally have a little trouble with taking a verse, or part of a verse, and quoting it out of its context. All kinds of ridiculous doctrines have emerged that way. I am not critisizing Teshuvah, simply stating the obvious and responding to the suggestion that the "law is sin?"
I will respond thusly: It is written: "All Scripture is inspired by Elohim and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of Elohim may be adequate, equipped for every good work." 2 Tim 3:16-17; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Sombra on June 18, 2009 at 9:03pm: My girlfriend's view of this verse is that it is a proof that we don't need to do the law anymore, because it's (the Torah's) purpose was to point out our sin.... but now that we have salvation in Yeshua,.. forgiveness for our sin.. we don't need it pointed out to us anymore.

rhetorical or not, it's still good to midrash, so that we we have answers for those who oppose our Torah keeping; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Mary on June 19, 2009 at 2:45am: I was in a class recently (non-Messianic) where we discussed the purpose of the Law being to show us where we fall short in relation to G-d's perfect standard, i.e, to point out our sin. There are many in this group who believe the law has been done away with. One young man in the class pointed out that during the times of the OT, the Law showed us our sin but now we have the Holy Spirit to show us our sin. At this point the following verse came to my mind.

Jeremiah 31:33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the LORD, I will put My law in their inward parts, and in their heart will I write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people;

This verse is repeated twice in the book of Hebrews. I was able to point out that it is still the Law that makes us aware of sin, the Torah of G-d, written in our hearts. The Holy Spirit convicts us of sin by bringing the law to our remembrance. And yes we still need to have our sin pointed out because repentence is a New Testament concept as well. Note I John.

1Jn 1:8-10 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Just my thoughts,

Mary in WY; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Spitfire on June 29, 2009 at 10:59pm: Is not Yeshua the living Torah? Then how could the Torah be sin since that would mean Yeshua would be sin...... But to use the words quoted, the law could not be sin because that would mean Yeshua sinned. And since the B'rit Hadashah says more than once that Yeshua was without sin, then the law (or Torah) can not be sin. Did I make any sense or am I talking in circles that only I understand?! Shalom, Spitfire; ▶ Reply to This